What's the best tire for my trailer?

 We have all probably seen this question on an RV forum or two. The problem is that many people have their personal choice but I doubt that any person has ever done any extensive controlled testing. If you think about it, why would anyone have a favorite brand but would be running a different brand unless forced?

As a tire design engineer I always depend on facts and data, and try and stay away from just an opinion. However since there is no way I can do a comparison of dozens of different brands in dozens of different sizes I do have to fall back on "opinion".  BUT if we think about tire performance and durability in general I think we can come up with some information that can guide us to a shorter list of potential choices.

All tires have a "Material List" molded on the sidewall. Based on this information plus a few generalities I think we can develop a plan.

Looking at your current tires you will see what materials are in your current tires. I suggest you write the information down so you can keep the information organized.

Lets talk about tire construction.                 Modern ST type radials will usually have one or possibly two ply or layers (we can use the terms interchangeably)  in the sidewall. The material used is usually Polyester. They will also have two ply of steel belts in the tread. Now this is the important detail. Some tires may also have one or two ply of Nylon or some other material in the tread in addition to the 2 ply of steel. This is the important part.

Radial tires have a high stress location at the edges of the belt. I have a number of posts on my RVTireSafety blog that focus on this force (Interply Shear) and location.  Here is the most important one

One way that tire companies can address the Interply Shear and end up with a tire that might perform better on the special tests like High Speed that tires need to tolerate if they are going to have a higher "Speed Symbol" marking is to add a ply of Nylon on top of the steel belts.

Now the problem you as a consumer face, is that not all tire companies report the materials in their advertising. But the good news is that the information molded on the tire sidewall must, by law, be accurate. So if the tire says it has Nylon ply it must have the Nylon. Now a performance improvement is not guaranteed but in general, it is likely that tires with Nylon ply above the steel belt edges can have lower Interply Shear forces which should perform better and possibly longer. So lacking any other data, I would use the Nylon as a plus for a tire if I were considering two different brand tires. 

You may need to talk with a tire dealer and possibly need to confirm yourself what the material list on a tire actually says.

Bottom line:

You can confirm which ST type tire you are considering has the Nylon cap ply and which does not. If they are different then it is possible that the tire with the Nylon might be a better choice. Please remember that this is not an absolute, as without actual performance data we can not be certain of the future performance. But this is something we can consider and this data is better than just a wild guess.

##RVT1034

Tire Advertising claims ???

Read this on an RV forum.

"I am using Carlisle Radial Trail HD Trailer Tire, not at all but I think it is a good tire for my trailer. these tires have an added protection against the heat with built-in weathering and ozone protection. And with the summer months getting into their absolute hottest parts, this feature could be a nice addition to have in my trailer tires. Additionally, these tires have interconnected tread blocks that I find encouraging. See, this interconnected tread blocks ensure the tread will last for a longer time and that’s something I find it very intriguing."

I have nothing against Carlisle.  I do find the ability of Copywriters to make features common to almost all tires sound unique and special. I do question the ability of anti-ozone waxes and oils to provide any "protection against heat" and I consider that claim a serious stretch. I would love to see any test data that supported that claim.

Be a smart shopper and don't fall for slick promotional claims. Ask to see the data and results from direct comparison tests. You will many times just get the sound of crickets.

Are Hankook tires any good?

Read this question from an owner of a large RV

"Looking to replace the tires on my 33 MH. Was thinking about Hankook as I only put 3500-5000 miles per year on them, But I have seen a lot of negative reviews fo Hankook tires on cars but not seeing much on RV tires. Any suggestion?
Thanks"

My answer

While I can't address negative reports on some applications for some brands I do know that I can find negative posts on just about every brand tire I ever heard of.
A couple of points

No company that makes Passenger, Light Truck and Heavy truck (RV) tires make them with the same materials or on the same building machines. I doubt that you think that winning the Indy 500 means you can expect the same materials or process to be used in your 365/70R22.5 LR-J tire.
I have a couple of posts on my blog with links to videos of tire manufacturing process new and old, showing just how different the manufacturing process can be. The raw materials are different and the internal QA testing is different, so I don't feel it is reasonable to use a broad brush of "negative reviews" from some individuals to consider all the tires a company makes must also be bad especially given the well-documented cases of poor or non-existant tire maintenance for so many vehicle owners.

When people ask me for recommendations for tires I offer a couple of suggestions:
1. You can check with NHTSA and check for current recalls for the brand and type tire you are considering.
2. Visit the company web site and see if you can locate dealers or stores in the states you travel to. If there are hundreds of stores then it would follow that it should be easier to get service and that millions of consumers must be happy with the products that the company makes. When doing this check confirm that you have visited the appropriate company web site. Some companies separate passenger and Heavy Truck dealers and you should not expect to be able to get service for your 22.5" tires at a passenger tire dealer
3. Don't use purchase price as your primary yardstick
Things to think about. What was the complaint in the negative review? price? Service at a particular store? The tires didn't deliver 70,000 miles wear? The fact that the tire suffered a puncture? Maybe even a complaint about a tire failure but the failure was traced to a valve core leak. I have even heard some complaints about the style of lettering on a tire sidewall.

Bottom line I know of no reason to not include Hankook brand on your shortlist.


##RVT913

Is it true a pick-up tire is better than a trailer tire?

That's a question I received the other day. Here is my reply.

Well, I'm not sure, is Spaghetti better than Lasagna?

Ok seriously. No good way to answer your question as an LT tire is intended for passenger-carrying vehicles while ST type tires are specifically designed for trailers not carrying any passengers.

The Load formula for these two different type tires is different, just as the formula for P-type or passenger car type tires are different. ST type tires are rated for about 15% greater load capacity, depending on the specific size, but with a max speed of 65 mph.  So if you never exceed 65 mph, ST type is "better" as they are rated for higher load.

BUT

DOT testing for LT type tires is more substantial (more difficult) and has more requirements than the requirements for ST type tires. So if you believe that being able to pass more difficult tests indicates a "better" tire and you want better durability then LT tires are better.

Now if you want to compare two different size or different Load Range tires but the same load capacity then IMO most LT tires are probably better than most ST type tires based on their ability to pass the more difficult DOT tests which are based on load. 

BUT

What if you consider lower-cost your "measure" when comparing tires you might find that many ST type tires have a lower price than many LT type tires.

##RVT910

Remember: A tire is just a "tool" you use to get a job done

This in response to a report of tread cracking of some traction design tires placed on a custom heavy car hauler trailer. The owner was blaming the 4-year-old tires.

I do note that when there are tire problems, including actual "failure," it's common for some to say "My xxx brand tires failed, I will never buy xxx tires again".

Well, sorry to tell you but there is no such thing as "Fail-Proof" tire. This was even part of the testimony mentioned by DOT spokesperson during the Ford Explorer rollover fiasco of 2000.

Today's tires are amazingly robust. Even when they are made in Japan or Timbuktu, and we all remember how bad "Made In Japan" was when were growing up. As I pointed out in the thread, the subject tire an All season traction design was not at all appropriate for heavy trailer application. Both the tire type/size was wrong and the tread pattern was wrong.

Why is this the tire's fault?

If you put a truck tire with a heavy off-road mud traction tread design on the front of your 40' DP and had loud noise and vibration and harsh ride would that be the tire's fault? Would simply changing tire brands from say Bridgestone to Michelin solve the problems if you selected just another heavy off-road mud traction tread design? No of course not.
From my experiences as a tire engineer, I can tell you that I can probably "fail" any tire in under an hour and under 50 miles if you let me set the conditions.

A tire is just a tool you use to get a job done. If you don't select the correct tool that is appropriate for the job you want to be done why is it the fault of the tool manufacturer? Think of the absolute best tool company. Now select one of their flat blade screwdrivers.
 OK now start using it as a chisel and pound on it as you try and cut through some rusty bolts. After cutting through a few bolts would you blame SK or MAC or  Snap-On or ???? if the point of the screwdriver is dented and chipped?

Different tires are just tools with different intended usage.

Basically I would suggest "Rib" or "All position" designs for the front position and if you intend on occasional off-highway travel (a gravel road at a campground doesn't count) then you could select something with a bit more traction capability but I would consider any "Drive" position as not a great choice for Motorhomes or trailers.

Which brand tire is better ? I can set up a test if you really want the answer.

Many people ask the question in various RV forums "I need new tires. What is the best brand tire I can get?" or "Why do tires made by company Q seem to have a high a failure rate?"

Invariably the thread quickly devolves into people providing their opinion but I do not recall ever seen the suggestion that one brand is better than another supported with any data based on direct apples to apples comparison of two brands of tires.

I believe there are two reasons for not getting a clear picture of which tires provide better service in RV application: One reason is personal pride and the other is a lack of direct comparison based on equivalent exposure to service problems.

Personal Pride
I think you will find that many posts IMO are based on the concept that people do not want to consider the possibility that the product they bought isn't the best. To think so could be an indication that someone might not be making the best purchasing decisions. For example, if someone asks about Acme brand anvils, and someone just happened to have purchased an Acme anvil they are more than willing to "badmouth" anvils made by almost any competitor even when they lack either meaningful data or solid experience to justify their position. After all why would they admit to just having purchased a good quality anvil?

Direct comparison of tire performance.

You may not be interested in ST type tire but I would hope that if you review this information it may help you make a more informed decision when asking what brand to buy.

If you consider that the OE market in ST type tires in RV trailer application is dominated by Goodyear and many dozen 3rd or 4th tier tire companies who make tires in small lots and don't even apply the name of the tire company to the tires they are making. With GY having a majority of the market and no other brand having much more than 5% I think you can see how it easy to end up with skewed impression that GY tires are bad, based simply on the observation that the greatest number of complaints are about Goodyear ST type tires. This is much like the concept that tires made in China must be poor quality because so many trailer owners that have problems with their tires discover they are made in China. I have to wonder how people expect to be able to make a reasonable comparison of tire quality based on country of origin when probably 90+% of RV trailers with ST type tires come OE with tires made in China. Wouldn't it seem reasonable then that 90+% of problems experienced on RV trailers with ST type tires would have tires that were made in China?

Now in 22.5 rim diameter tires found on Class-A RVs,  I think we see Michelins with sidewall cracking complaints and Goodyears with irregular wear complaints and since those two companies probably are on 70+% of coaches of course those are the ones that would have the most and therefore most noticeable complaints. Even if another company with maybe 5% of the market had tire failures  at twice the rate of GY or MI cosmetic issues, it would still appear that GY and MI are the only tires with problems.

Check out my post on Causation vs Correlation for more on the topic.

Thorough tire testing costs in the neighborhood of $30k to over $100k per brand for just basic outdoor wear and general durability is it any wonder that no independent agency has stepped up and run such a comparison?

Now I have the contacts in the tire industry to an independent testing company that could run such a comparison. All I need is for people to send me contributions - maybe in $500 increments and I will develop the specifications for a direct comparison between Goodyear ST type tires and Maxxis brand ST type tires plus a set of TowMax or similar ST type tires. I would use a popular size and load range made by all three companies. To keep costs down we would limit the test duration to about 10,000 miles or till there are enough failures to discontinue running that brand. I figure two failures would be enough to stop running a given brand.

So do you really want to see actual data? All I need is $35,000 in the bank to start the evaluation. Test results would be sent only to those making the minimum $350 contribution or more.
If interested send me an email and I can send you specific details of this offer. We only need 100 individual contributions to get started.


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What is the Best Trailer Tire?

I frequently get asked "What is the Best tire for my trailer?

I don't want another blowout"

My answer:

 I previously did a post on "Best Tire".


Sorry there is not enough data to provide a more focused answer.  I am sure some are hoping I would provide the one size and one brand that will solve all their tire problems.
I would point everyone back to this link from an RV forum with data from NHTSA. As you can see the numbers of RV owners that make the minimal effort to file a complaint sends the message to NHTSA that there are no significant problems with RV tires. I also know from looking at some of the complaints the quality of the information is spotty even if a complaint was filed.

Examples include wrong size, wrong tire brand, missing or incomplete DOT serial. Expecting information on actual load, speed etc is unrealistic and expecting an accurate description of the real failure is just a dream.

Engineers react to and work with facts. I have been trying to educate a few folks on another forum that melted body ply cord, as seen in tires with a Run Low Flex Failure


is physical evidence of a tire having been run under-inflated at highway speed. The discussion ended with one poster accusing me of hiding the facts and lying to keep my job. Of course he had no idea why the body cord melted but was certain I didn't know either. That ended my participation on that thread.

I know of no data to indicate that anyone is intentionally making "bad" tires. I do know of data that confirms the majority of RVs have tires in overload and that a significant percentage of tires on the highway are under-inflated. I share with others the  personal observations that a good number of trailers are exceeding the speed limit of their tires.

Multi-axle trailers place unique and high side loading on tires. This cause internal forces that contribute to the short life for tires in this application. This is a fact based on engineering and all tires are subjected to this type of structural load. It is just a fact that multi axle trailers are worse than single axle RVs.

Bottom Line
If you want to minimize the probability of having a tire failure on your multi-axle trailer, all I can suggest is you read my post on "Best tire", inflate your tires to the sidewall inflation 100% of the time, at least once confirm your side to side and axle to axle unbalance is not giving you an overloaded tire, use TPMS w/metal valve stems and do a free spin inspection at least once a year.

 and cover your tires with WHITE cover whenever parked in the sun for more than a day. You will probably still only get 4-5 years out of your tires because of the internal stress load but hopefully they will be 5 years with no problems.


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What is the "Best" tire?

A couple of recurring questions on many of the RV Forums are "What brand tire should I buy?" or "What is the best tire for my RV?"

While this seems like a simple, straight forward question, the answer is complex. Some people use past experience. If they used Brand Q in the past on their car and had no problems they believe that means they should have no problems on their 22.5" sizes. I don't think this is a sound way to make a decision on the quality of a company's tires. The information on the Ford Pinto gas tank made headlines, even though actual incident data concluded the Pinto was as safe as, or safer than, other cars in its class. But do the news headlines mean that the gas tank of a F350 will have problems?

Others may have had a problem with a tire and since the root cause for the problem was not properly diagnosed, they decided the tire failure must have been due to a defect, so their position is that all Brand Q tires must be bad. Making this decision may be just as wrong as the previous example.

In my experience, less than one percent of tire failures are really studied to the point that there is a high confidence in knowing what the real reason for the failure was. It may have been due to a puncture or a sidewall impact or leaking valve or out of align axle or damaged wheel or some other reason. Since most of the time people don't know the real reason, they simply say "I had a blowout" or "I had a bulge" or the "sidewalls were badly cracked" ...so they assume the tire must have been defective.

EVEN IF THERE IS A BATCH OF TIRES with some manufacturing defect, there could actually be only a  dozen or so tires affected. Of course, it could also be thousands. The announced size of a recall is not a good measure as even if a company knows that a relatively small number of tires had the manufacturing error they have to recall many times more than the actual number as most times there is no easy way for consumers or even dealers to properly identify which tires were defective. I have personal experience of identifying a batch of less than 150 tires being made with an incorrect component. Given the opportunity, I felt I could have identified 99.9% of the tires with the defect but the cost associated with getting the tires shipped to Akron and completing the examination was prohibitive. And what does the owner do while this examination is going on? In the end more than 6,000 tires were recalled, scrapped and new tires given to customers to ensure that all the tires in the group of 150 were captures. The number 6,000 is what made the news not the 150.

Also in light of the fact that there are lawyers that will be happy to file a lawsuit and hope the company will settle because they know it is less expensive to settle than go to the costs necessary to prove yourself  innocent. Even when the facts are on the company' side, some juries will vote for the individual simply because they don't like big companies. I worked as an expert witness on such a case and even with physical evidence establishing where the fault of the accident was, the case was settled out of court rather than fight it.

So I still haven't answered the question. I will however offer some guidelines and things to consider when you are trying to select a brand in your size.

1. Does the company have a nationwide dealer and store network to provide service and warranty support or do you have to contact some company with only one office and only a single person who can approve a replacement? A check of the tire manufacturer website will quickly give you a feeling of confidence or not, in its operations. Some tire companies offer a lot of information. Others may have a website but its internal company links do not work. The company does not provide any way to send anyone an email to ask a question. They don't even have an 800 phone number to call so you can talk to someone. I would be hesitant to deal with such a disorganized company.

2. What are the terms of the tire warranty? Many times there are both time and percentage figures regarding wear limits. Be sure you read and understand what is covered and what is not.

3. How do you obtain an adjustment? Do you only need to return the tire to a local dealer? or do you need to return the tire to the location where you purchased the tire?. Or must you pay to ship the tire to the importer many states away from where you live?

4. Have you consulted the NHTSA web site to see if there are recalls, investigations or even complaints on the specific tire you are considering?

I think if you follow these four steps and ask yourself if the company you are considering deserves your business. Yes there is a temptation to simply buy the cheapest tires available but the saying "Pay me now or pay me later" is certainly appropriate when it comes to  making this important safety related decision.